When to give up seeking justice after you've been plagiarized?












17















I found that a Ph.D. student, recently graduated, plagiarized over a dozen passages from a book I based on my own Ph.D. dissertation of some years ago.



In most instances the student cited me as a source at the end of sometimes long, closely paraphrased passages. I believe this still constitutes plagiarism in the form of "excessive paraphrasing."



As UNC-Chapel Hill notes, for example:




"Even if you cite your source, paraphrasing can still be plagiarism if all you do is rearrange the author's words, delete a phrase or two, or insert a few synonyms and claim the passage as your own."




When I reported the student to their dissertation committee chairperson, nothing happened. The chairperson did not even report the matter as required to the administration.



Dissatisfied, I took the matter to the university's director of student ethics, who told me I had a strong case not only for plagiarism, but for unprofessional conduct. The director assigned a random professor to investigate, who absolved the student of wrongdoing. The only reason given was lack of evidence of intent to deceive.



Again dissatisfied, I took the matter to the president of the university, who agreed to hear my concern. Once I revealed the nature of that concern, however, the president no longer responded. Even the president's assistant, whom the president had included on the discussion, no longer responded.



I have been careful not to come across as a loon (between the president and his assistant, for example, I sent only four emails, only two of which were follow-ups saying "I haven't heard from you: can you confirm receipt?") In short, I think I have responded as any rational person might in such a situation.



I should add I am an experienced scholar widely known in my field. But because I am no longer affiliated with a university, I have no one to represent me. (My publisher says it will take action only if the plagiarism appears in print.)



My question is: at what point should I give up seeking justice? (I would have been content with the student merely rewriting the paraphrased material - but discussions never reached the subject of remediation.)










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  • 3





    @ Solar Mike, I am told by an attorney friend there is no point in involving attorneys because there is no material loss on my part. If, however, the student publishes the dissertation as a book, then an attorney could be involved, even if the loss involved is negligible. (We aren't talking Harry Potter, after all, but obscure academic works.) My publisher did contact the student formally and threaten legal action, but, again, only if the student should publish the plagiarized text.

    – Grinnell
    9 hours ago






  • 2





    Was the student's PhD supported by a research funding agency that has an office that can investigate ethics complaints?

    – Brian Borchers
    9 hours ago






  • 1





    Have you considered putting online a document, web page or blog post analyzing the relevant paragraphs from both theses? This will make the facts known and let people draw their own conclusions. Let the community decide if they consider it important. To minimize risk of being accused of defamation, stick to factual statements supported by hard evidence.

    – Dan Romik
    8 hours ago






  • 1





    @Grinnell OK, I see... So maybe those people in that non-US university overseas have completely different definition of plagiarism (who knows...) but I'm guessing the student completed his/her PhD somewhere in the Europe or Australia maybe cause if he/she is from third world countries, you might want to stop putting your efforts and time to seek "Justice"...

    – Alone Programmer
    7 hours ago






  • 10





    What are you hoping to achieve?

    – Thomas
    7 hours ago
















17















I found that a Ph.D. student, recently graduated, plagiarized over a dozen passages from a book I based on my own Ph.D. dissertation of some years ago.



In most instances the student cited me as a source at the end of sometimes long, closely paraphrased passages. I believe this still constitutes plagiarism in the form of "excessive paraphrasing."



As UNC-Chapel Hill notes, for example:




"Even if you cite your source, paraphrasing can still be plagiarism if all you do is rearrange the author's words, delete a phrase or two, or insert a few synonyms and claim the passage as your own."




When I reported the student to their dissertation committee chairperson, nothing happened. The chairperson did not even report the matter as required to the administration.



Dissatisfied, I took the matter to the university's director of student ethics, who told me I had a strong case not only for plagiarism, but for unprofessional conduct. The director assigned a random professor to investigate, who absolved the student of wrongdoing. The only reason given was lack of evidence of intent to deceive.



Again dissatisfied, I took the matter to the president of the university, who agreed to hear my concern. Once I revealed the nature of that concern, however, the president no longer responded. Even the president's assistant, whom the president had included on the discussion, no longer responded.



I have been careful not to come across as a loon (between the president and his assistant, for example, I sent only four emails, only two of which were follow-ups saying "I haven't heard from you: can you confirm receipt?") In short, I think I have responded as any rational person might in such a situation.



I should add I am an experienced scholar widely known in my field. But because I am no longer affiliated with a university, I have no one to represent me. (My publisher says it will take action only if the plagiarism appears in print.)



My question is: at what point should I give up seeking justice? (I would have been content with the student merely rewriting the paraphrased material - but discussions never reached the subject of remediation.)










share|improve this question









New contributor




Grinnell is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.
















  • 3





    @ Solar Mike, I am told by an attorney friend there is no point in involving attorneys because there is no material loss on my part. If, however, the student publishes the dissertation as a book, then an attorney could be involved, even if the loss involved is negligible. (We aren't talking Harry Potter, after all, but obscure academic works.) My publisher did contact the student formally and threaten legal action, but, again, only if the student should publish the plagiarized text.

    – Grinnell
    9 hours ago






  • 2





    Was the student's PhD supported by a research funding agency that has an office that can investigate ethics complaints?

    – Brian Borchers
    9 hours ago






  • 1





    Have you considered putting online a document, web page or blog post analyzing the relevant paragraphs from both theses? This will make the facts known and let people draw their own conclusions. Let the community decide if they consider it important. To minimize risk of being accused of defamation, stick to factual statements supported by hard evidence.

    – Dan Romik
    8 hours ago






  • 1





    @Grinnell OK, I see... So maybe those people in that non-US university overseas have completely different definition of plagiarism (who knows...) but I'm guessing the student completed his/her PhD somewhere in the Europe or Australia maybe cause if he/she is from third world countries, you might want to stop putting your efforts and time to seek "Justice"...

    – Alone Programmer
    7 hours ago






  • 10





    What are you hoping to achieve?

    – Thomas
    7 hours ago














17












17








17


1






I found that a Ph.D. student, recently graduated, plagiarized over a dozen passages from a book I based on my own Ph.D. dissertation of some years ago.



In most instances the student cited me as a source at the end of sometimes long, closely paraphrased passages. I believe this still constitutes plagiarism in the form of "excessive paraphrasing."



As UNC-Chapel Hill notes, for example:




"Even if you cite your source, paraphrasing can still be plagiarism if all you do is rearrange the author's words, delete a phrase or two, or insert a few synonyms and claim the passage as your own."




When I reported the student to their dissertation committee chairperson, nothing happened. The chairperson did not even report the matter as required to the administration.



Dissatisfied, I took the matter to the university's director of student ethics, who told me I had a strong case not only for plagiarism, but for unprofessional conduct. The director assigned a random professor to investigate, who absolved the student of wrongdoing. The only reason given was lack of evidence of intent to deceive.



Again dissatisfied, I took the matter to the president of the university, who agreed to hear my concern. Once I revealed the nature of that concern, however, the president no longer responded. Even the president's assistant, whom the president had included on the discussion, no longer responded.



I have been careful not to come across as a loon (between the president and his assistant, for example, I sent only four emails, only two of which were follow-ups saying "I haven't heard from you: can you confirm receipt?") In short, I think I have responded as any rational person might in such a situation.



I should add I am an experienced scholar widely known in my field. But because I am no longer affiliated with a university, I have no one to represent me. (My publisher says it will take action only if the plagiarism appears in print.)



My question is: at what point should I give up seeking justice? (I would have been content with the student merely rewriting the paraphrased material - but discussions never reached the subject of remediation.)










share|improve this question









New contributor




Grinnell is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.












I found that a Ph.D. student, recently graduated, plagiarized over a dozen passages from a book I based on my own Ph.D. dissertation of some years ago.



In most instances the student cited me as a source at the end of sometimes long, closely paraphrased passages. I believe this still constitutes plagiarism in the form of "excessive paraphrasing."



As UNC-Chapel Hill notes, for example:




"Even if you cite your source, paraphrasing can still be plagiarism if all you do is rearrange the author's words, delete a phrase or two, or insert a few synonyms and claim the passage as your own."




When I reported the student to their dissertation committee chairperson, nothing happened. The chairperson did not even report the matter as required to the administration.



Dissatisfied, I took the matter to the university's director of student ethics, who told me I had a strong case not only for plagiarism, but for unprofessional conduct. The director assigned a random professor to investigate, who absolved the student of wrongdoing. The only reason given was lack of evidence of intent to deceive.



Again dissatisfied, I took the matter to the president of the university, who agreed to hear my concern. Once I revealed the nature of that concern, however, the president no longer responded. Even the president's assistant, whom the president had included on the discussion, no longer responded.



I have been careful not to come across as a loon (between the president and his assistant, for example, I sent only four emails, only two of which were follow-ups saying "I haven't heard from you: can you confirm receipt?") In short, I think I have responded as any rational person might in such a situation.



I should add I am an experienced scholar widely known in my field. But because I am no longer affiliated with a university, I have no one to represent me. (My publisher says it will take action only if the plagiarism appears in print.)



My question is: at what point should I give up seeking justice? (I would have been content with the student merely rewriting the paraphrased material - but discussions never reached the subject of remediation.)







plagiarism






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edited 4 hours ago









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asked 10 hours ago









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Check out our Code of Conduct.






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Check out our Code of Conduct.








  • 3





    @ Solar Mike, I am told by an attorney friend there is no point in involving attorneys because there is no material loss on my part. If, however, the student publishes the dissertation as a book, then an attorney could be involved, even if the loss involved is negligible. (We aren't talking Harry Potter, after all, but obscure academic works.) My publisher did contact the student formally and threaten legal action, but, again, only if the student should publish the plagiarized text.

    – Grinnell
    9 hours ago






  • 2





    Was the student's PhD supported by a research funding agency that has an office that can investigate ethics complaints?

    – Brian Borchers
    9 hours ago






  • 1





    Have you considered putting online a document, web page or blog post analyzing the relevant paragraphs from both theses? This will make the facts known and let people draw their own conclusions. Let the community decide if they consider it important. To minimize risk of being accused of defamation, stick to factual statements supported by hard evidence.

    – Dan Romik
    8 hours ago






  • 1





    @Grinnell OK, I see... So maybe those people in that non-US university overseas have completely different definition of plagiarism (who knows...) but I'm guessing the student completed his/her PhD somewhere in the Europe or Australia maybe cause if he/she is from third world countries, you might want to stop putting your efforts and time to seek "Justice"...

    – Alone Programmer
    7 hours ago






  • 10





    What are you hoping to achieve?

    – Thomas
    7 hours ago














  • 3





    @ Solar Mike, I am told by an attorney friend there is no point in involving attorneys because there is no material loss on my part. If, however, the student publishes the dissertation as a book, then an attorney could be involved, even if the loss involved is negligible. (We aren't talking Harry Potter, after all, but obscure academic works.) My publisher did contact the student formally and threaten legal action, but, again, only if the student should publish the plagiarized text.

    – Grinnell
    9 hours ago






  • 2





    Was the student's PhD supported by a research funding agency that has an office that can investigate ethics complaints?

    – Brian Borchers
    9 hours ago






  • 1





    Have you considered putting online a document, web page or blog post analyzing the relevant paragraphs from both theses? This will make the facts known and let people draw their own conclusions. Let the community decide if they consider it important. To minimize risk of being accused of defamation, stick to factual statements supported by hard evidence.

    – Dan Romik
    8 hours ago






  • 1





    @Grinnell OK, I see... So maybe those people in that non-US university overseas have completely different definition of plagiarism (who knows...) but I'm guessing the student completed his/her PhD somewhere in the Europe or Australia maybe cause if he/she is from third world countries, you might want to stop putting your efforts and time to seek "Justice"...

    – Alone Programmer
    7 hours ago






  • 10





    What are you hoping to achieve?

    – Thomas
    7 hours ago








3




3





@ Solar Mike, I am told by an attorney friend there is no point in involving attorneys because there is no material loss on my part. If, however, the student publishes the dissertation as a book, then an attorney could be involved, even if the loss involved is negligible. (We aren't talking Harry Potter, after all, but obscure academic works.) My publisher did contact the student formally and threaten legal action, but, again, only if the student should publish the plagiarized text.

– Grinnell
9 hours ago





@ Solar Mike, I am told by an attorney friend there is no point in involving attorneys because there is no material loss on my part. If, however, the student publishes the dissertation as a book, then an attorney could be involved, even if the loss involved is negligible. (We aren't talking Harry Potter, after all, but obscure academic works.) My publisher did contact the student formally and threaten legal action, but, again, only if the student should publish the plagiarized text.

– Grinnell
9 hours ago




2




2





Was the student's PhD supported by a research funding agency that has an office that can investigate ethics complaints?

– Brian Borchers
9 hours ago





Was the student's PhD supported by a research funding agency that has an office that can investigate ethics complaints?

– Brian Borchers
9 hours ago




1




1





Have you considered putting online a document, web page or blog post analyzing the relevant paragraphs from both theses? This will make the facts known and let people draw their own conclusions. Let the community decide if they consider it important. To minimize risk of being accused of defamation, stick to factual statements supported by hard evidence.

– Dan Romik
8 hours ago





Have you considered putting online a document, web page or blog post analyzing the relevant paragraphs from both theses? This will make the facts known and let people draw their own conclusions. Let the community decide if they consider it important. To minimize risk of being accused of defamation, stick to factual statements supported by hard evidence.

– Dan Romik
8 hours ago




1




1





@Grinnell OK, I see... So maybe those people in that non-US university overseas have completely different definition of plagiarism (who knows...) but I'm guessing the student completed his/her PhD somewhere in the Europe or Australia maybe cause if he/she is from third world countries, you might want to stop putting your efforts and time to seek "Justice"...

– Alone Programmer
7 hours ago





@Grinnell OK, I see... So maybe those people in that non-US university overseas have completely different definition of plagiarism (who knows...) but I'm guessing the student completed his/her PhD somewhere in the Europe or Australia maybe cause if he/she is from third world countries, you might want to stop putting your efforts and time to seek "Justice"...

– Alone Programmer
7 hours ago




10




10





What are you hoping to achieve?

– Thomas
7 hours ago





What are you hoping to achieve?

– Thomas
7 hours ago










2 Answers
2






active

oldest

votes


















12














As you know, there are two separate issues with plagiarism:




  • Claiming ideas as one's own

  • Claiming words as one's own


You have a legitimate concern about the second -- if this student is going to directly use your words, he needs to use quotes. Attempts to get around this by making one or two insignificant changes are not appropriate.



That said, I can understand why the president of the university didn't want to get involved -- as academic crimes go, this one is quite minor. I agree that the "lack of intent to deceive" ruling was erroneous, which is unfortunate; getting the student to re-write the content, with no other penalty, would have been a far more appropriate outcome.




At what point should I give up seeking justice?




I think it would be appropriate to reach out to the student (I would have started here, personally), their advisor, and the university's ombudsperson (in that order), just asking them to rewrite those sections and to not do it again. If they refuse, it would probably take a lawyer to get them to listen -- but you don't have any damages (not even to your reputation), so that seems a bit excessive in this case.






share|improve this answer



















  • 3





    Actually, paraphrasing is a legitimate way to cite, in which case quotes aren't needed. But quoting without indicating it is a quote is wrong, And, again, if it is cited, then it isn't an attempt to claim it as your own.

    – Buffy
    7 hours ago








  • 2





    Paraphrasing is fine, but this student seems to have copied a long passage word-for-word, made one or two trivial changes, and then said "oh, I made some insignificant changes, so I don't need the quotation marks anymore." This would not be appropriate -- paraphrasing entails a non-trivial re-write of the material, ideally to place it in a novel context. By not using quotes, the student is (inadvertently) claiming to have done this. But yeah, if the student did make non-trivial changes to the text, then there is no issue at all.

    – cag51
    6 hours ago






  • 2





    @Buffy There are acceptable and unacceptable forms of paraphrasing. Clearly, many universities feel it is possible to excessively paraphrase. One need only google excessive paraphrasing or paraphrase excessively plus the suffix .edu to see what I mean.

    – Grinnell
    4 hours ago





















10














You seem to be confusing two things. Copyright is about words. Plagiarism is about ideas. If you have something copyrighted (almost anything you write and publish) copying your words is possibly a violation. The other paper may be have overstepped the bounds of copyright here.



But if they credit you with the underlying ideas behind the words, then it isn't plagiarism and is probably why people stop responding when you explain what happened. If the other person says or implies "these are my ideas" when, in fact, they are yours, they have plagiarized and that is true even if they use none of your words to express the idea.



But if you are credited, it just isn't plagiarism. A reader of the other work seem to be able to go to your work to find a more complete context of the idea and the original words.



You may, however, have a copyright claim or not, but it is a completely different issue. It is possible, also, that in publishing a book, you gave your copyright to your publisher. In that case it is up to them to make the claim.





Note that I'm not saying that what was done was ok, just that it better to be accurate in a claim of wrongdoing than to be inaccurate and confuse things.



And to be honest, I'm not close enough to the problem nor do I know enough to be able to say definitively that there is wrongdoing here or not. So I reserve judgement on that.






share|improve this answer





















  • 6





    I understand what you're saying ("if you are credited, it just isn't plagiarism"), but excessive paraphrasing, even if the original author is credited, is widely regarded as plagiarism. See the above UNC-Chapel Hill quote about this in my original post. Even Harvard notes "It's not enough to change a few words here and there and leave the rest; instead, you must completely restate the ideas in the passage in your own words. If your own language is too close to the original, then you are plagiarizing, even if you do provide a citation" (Harvard's emphasis).

    – Grinnell
    9 hours ago








  • 4





    The difference is widely misunderstood. It can be plagiarism if the other uses none of your words. Plagiarism isn't about the expression of the idea, but about the idea itself. "Plagiarism is the "wrongful appropriation" and "stealing and publication" of another author's "language, thoughts, ideas, or expressions" and the representation of them as one's own original work." Note the last phrase ... and the representation of them as one's own original work. Wikipedia. The last phrase is the essential element.

    – Buffy
    8 hours ago








  • 4





    I don't claim it isn't a violation, but it would be of copyright. A different matter with a different solution.

    – Buffy
    7 hours ago






  • 3





    Regarding your quote from the Wiki article, this supports that this is plagiarism. In particular, this is the "wrongful appropriation" of another author's "language." Wrongful appropriation of either language or ideas is still plagiarism. The distinction between plagiarism and copyright violation is more that the former is an academic integrity concern, while the latter is a legal concern. Plagiarism can concern either language or ideas, while copyright (of written works) is normally solely concerned with language.

    – reirab
    5 hours ago








  • 3





    @reirab I know my publisher stated in its letter to the student that publishing his work with the closely paraphrased text would in its opinion constitute copyright infringement. And it would constitute copyright infringement precisely because its plagiarism. I'm pretty sure the publisher consulted its attorney when composing the letter, as it told me it was going to do so.

    – Grinnell
    5 hours ago













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2 Answers
2






active

oldest

votes








2 Answers
2






active

oldest

votes









active

oldest

votes






active

oldest

votes









12














As you know, there are two separate issues with plagiarism:




  • Claiming ideas as one's own

  • Claiming words as one's own


You have a legitimate concern about the second -- if this student is going to directly use your words, he needs to use quotes. Attempts to get around this by making one or two insignificant changes are not appropriate.



That said, I can understand why the president of the university didn't want to get involved -- as academic crimes go, this one is quite minor. I agree that the "lack of intent to deceive" ruling was erroneous, which is unfortunate; getting the student to re-write the content, with no other penalty, would have been a far more appropriate outcome.




At what point should I give up seeking justice?




I think it would be appropriate to reach out to the student (I would have started here, personally), their advisor, and the university's ombudsperson (in that order), just asking them to rewrite those sections and to not do it again. If they refuse, it would probably take a lawyer to get them to listen -- but you don't have any damages (not even to your reputation), so that seems a bit excessive in this case.






share|improve this answer



















  • 3





    Actually, paraphrasing is a legitimate way to cite, in which case quotes aren't needed. But quoting without indicating it is a quote is wrong, And, again, if it is cited, then it isn't an attempt to claim it as your own.

    – Buffy
    7 hours ago








  • 2





    Paraphrasing is fine, but this student seems to have copied a long passage word-for-word, made one or two trivial changes, and then said "oh, I made some insignificant changes, so I don't need the quotation marks anymore." This would not be appropriate -- paraphrasing entails a non-trivial re-write of the material, ideally to place it in a novel context. By not using quotes, the student is (inadvertently) claiming to have done this. But yeah, if the student did make non-trivial changes to the text, then there is no issue at all.

    – cag51
    6 hours ago






  • 2





    @Buffy There are acceptable and unacceptable forms of paraphrasing. Clearly, many universities feel it is possible to excessively paraphrase. One need only google excessive paraphrasing or paraphrase excessively plus the suffix .edu to see what I mean.

    – Grinnell
    4 hours ago


















12














As you know, there are two separate issues with plagiarism:




  • Claiming ideas as one's own

  • Claiming words as one's own


You have a legitimate concern about the second -- if this student is going to directly use your words, he needs to use quotes. Attempts to get around this by making one or two insignificant changes are not appropriate.



That said, I can understand why the president of the university didn't want to get involved -- as academic crimes go, this one is quite minor. I agree that the "lack of intent to deceive" ruling was erroneous, which is unfortunate; getting the student to re-write the content, with no other penalty, would have been a far more appropriate outcome.




At what point should I give up seeking justice?




I think it would be appropriate to reach out to the student (I would have started here, personally), their advisor, and the university's ombudsperson (in that order), just asking them to rewrite those sections and to not do it again. If they refuse, it would probably take a lawyer to get them to listen -- but you don't have any damages (not even to your reputation), so that seems a bit excessive in this case.






share|improve this answer



















  • 3





    Actually, paraphrasing is a legitimate way to cite, in which case quotes aren't needed. But quoting without indicating it is a quote is wrong, And, again, if it is cited, then it isn't an attempt to claim it as your own.

    – Buffy
    7 hours ago








  • 2





    Paraphrasing is fine, but this student seems to have copied a long passage word-for-word, made one or two trivial changes, and then said "oh, I made some insignificant changes, so I don't need the quotation marks anymore." This would not be appropriate -- paraphrasing entails a non-trivial re-write of the material, ideally to place it in a novel context. By not using quotes, the student is (inadvertently) claiming to have done this. But yeah, if the student did make non-trivial changes to the text, then there is no issue at all.

    – cag51
    6 hours ago






  • 2





    @Buffy There are acceptable and unacceptable forms of paraphrasing. Clearly, many universities feel it is possible to excessively paraphrase. One need only google excessive paraphrasing or paraphrase excessively plus the suffix .edu to see what I mean.

    – Grinnell
    4 hours ago
















12












12








12







As you know, there are two separate issues with plagiarism:




  • Claiming ideas as one's own

  • Claiming words as one's own


You have a legitimate concern about the second -- if this student is going to directly use your words, he needs to use quotes. Attempts to get around this by making one or two insignificant changes are not appropriate.



That said, I can understand why the president of the university didn't want to get involved -- as academic crimes go, this one is quite minor. I agree that the "lack of intent to deceive" ruling was erroneous, which is unfortunate; getting the student to re-write the content, with no other penalty, would have been a far more appropriate outcome.




At what point should I give up seeking justice?




I think it would be appropriate to reach out to the student (I would have started here, personally), their advisor, and the university's ombudsperson (in that order), just asking them to rewrite those sections and to not do it again. If they refuse, it would probably take a lawyer to get them to listen -- but you don't have any damages (not even to your reputation), so that seems a bit excessive in this case.






share|improve this answer













As you know, there are two separate issues with plagiarism:




  • Claiming ideas as one's own

  • Claiming words as one's own


You have a legitimate concern about the second -- if this student is going to directly use your words, he needs to use quotes. Attempts to get around this by making one or two insignificant changes are not appropriate.



That said, I can understand why the president of the university didn't want to get involved -- as academic crimes go, this one is quite minor. I agree that the "lack of intent to deceive" ruling was erroneous, which is unfortunate; getting the student to re-write the content, with no other penalty, would have been a far more appropriate outcome.




At what point should I give up seeking justice?




I think it would be appropriate to reach out to the student (I would have started here, personally), their advisor, and the university's ombudsperson (in that order), just asking them to rewrite those sections and to not do it again. If they refuse, it would probably take a lawyer to get them to listen -- but you don't have any damages (not even to your reputation), so that seems a bit excessive in this case.







share|improve this answer












share|improve this answer



share|improve this answer










answered 7 hours ago









cag51cag51

14.2k53056




14.2k53056








  • 3





    Actually, paraphrasing is a legitimate way to cite, in which case quotes aren't needed. But quoting without indicating it is a quote is wrong, And, again, if it is cited, then it isn't an attempt to claim it as your own.

    – Buffy
    7 hours ago








  • 2





    Paraphrasing is fine, but this student seems to have copied a long passage word-for-word, made one or two trivial changes, and then said "oh, I made some insignificant changes, so I don't need the quotation marks anymore." This would not be appropriate -- paraphrasing entails a non-trivial re-write of the material, ideally to place it in a novel context. By not using quotes, the student is (inadvertently) claiming to have done this. But yeah, if the student did make non-trivial changes to the text, then there is no issue at all.

    – cag51
    6 hours ago






  • 2





    @Buffy There are acceptable and unacceptable forms of paraphrasing. Clearly, many universities feel it is possible to excessively paraphrase. One need only google excessive paraphrasing or paraphrase excessively plus the suffix .edu to see what I mean.

    – Grinnell
    4 hours ago
















  • 3





    Actually, paraphrasing is a legitimate way to cite, in which case quotes aren't needed. But quoting without indicating it is a quote is wrong, And, again, if it is cited, then it isn't an attempt to claim it as your own.

    – Buffy
    7 hours ago








  • 2





    Paraphrasing is fine, but this student seems to have copied a long passage word-for-word, made one or two trivial changes, and then said "oh, I made some insignificant changes, so I don't need the quotation marks anymore." This would not be appropriate -- paraphrasing entails a non-trivial re-write of the material, ideally to place it in a novel context. By not using quotes, the student is (inadvertently) claiming to have done this. But yeah, if the student did make non-trivial changes to the text, then there is no issue at all.

    – cag51
    6 hours ago






  • 2





    @Buffy There are acceptable and unacceptable forms of paraphrasing. Clearly, many universities feel it is possible to excessively paraphrase. One need only google excessive paraphrasing or paraphrase excessively plus the suffix .edu to see what I mean.

    – Grinnell
    4 hours ago










3




3





Actually, paraphrasing is a legitimate way to cite, in which case quotes aren't needed. But quoting without indicating it is a quote is wrong, And, again, if it is cited, then it isn't an attempt to claim it as your own.

– Buffy
7 hours ago







Actually, paraphrasing is a legitimate way to cite, in which case quotes aren't needed. But quoting without indicating it is a quote is wrong, And, again, if it is cited, then it isn't an attempt to claim it as your own.

– Buffy
7 hours ago






2




2





Paraphrasing is fine, but this student seems to have copied a long passage word-for-word, made one or two trivial changes, and then said "oh, I made some insignificant changes, so I don't need the quotation marks anymore." This would not be appropriate -- paraphrasing entails a non-trivial re-write of the material, ideally to place it in a novel context. By not using quotes, the student is (inadvertently) claiming to have done this. But yeah, if the student did make non-trivial changes to the text, then there is no issue at all.

– cag51
6 hours ago





Paraphrasing is fine, but this student seems to have copied a long passage word-for-word, made one or two trivial changes, and then said "oh, I made some insignificant changes, so I don't need the quotation marks anymore." This would not be appropriate -- paraphrasing entails a non-trivial re-write of the material, ideally to place it in a novel context. By not using quotes, the student is (inadvertently) claiming to have done this. But yeah, if the student did make non-trivial changes to the text, then there is no issue at all.

– cag51
6 hours ago




2




2





@Buffy There are acceptable and unacceptable forms of paraphrasing. Clearly, many universities feel it is possible to excessively paraphrase. One need only google excessive paraphrasing or paraphrase excessively plus the suffix .edu to see what I mean.

– Grinnell
4 hours ago







@Buffy There are acceptable and unacceptable forms of paraphrasing. Clearly, many universities feel it is possible to excessively paraphrase. One need only google excessive paraphrasing or paraphrase excessively plus the suffix .edu to see what I mean.

– Grinnell
4 hours ago













10














You seem to be confusing two things. Copyright is about words. Plagiarism is about ideas. If you have something copyrighted (almost anything you write and publish) copying your words is possibly a violation. The other paper may be have overstepped the bounds of copyright here.



But if they credit you with the underlying ideas behind the words, then it isn't plagiarism and is probably why people stop responding when you explain what happened. If the other person says or implies "these are my ideas" when, in fact, they are yours, they have plagiarized and that is true even if they use none of your words to express the idea.



But if you are credited, it just isn't plagiarism. A reader of the other work seem to be able to go to your work to find a more complete context of the idea and the original words.



You may, however, have a copyright claim or not, but it is a completely different issue. It is possible, also, that in publishing a book, you gave your copyright to your publisher. In that case it is up to them to make the claim.





Note that I'm not saying that what was done was ok, just that it better to be accurate in a claim of wrongdoing than to be inaccurate and confuse things.



And to be honest, I'm not close enough to the problem nor do I know enough to be able to say definitively that there is wrongdoing here or not. So I reserve judgement on that.






share|improve this answer





















  • 6





    I understand what you're saying ("if you are credited, it just isn't plagiarism"), but excessive paraphrasing, even if the original author is credited, is widely regarded as plagiarism. See the above UNC-Chapel Hill quote about this in my original post. Even Harvard notes "It's not enough to change a few words here and there and leave the rest; instead, you must completely restate the ideas in the passage in your own words. If your own language is too close to the original, then you are plagiarizing, even if you do provide a citation" (Harvard's emphasis).

    – Grinnell
    9 hours ago








  • 4





    The difference is widely misunderstood. It can be plagiarism if the other uses none of your words. Plagiarism isn't about the expression of the idea, but about the idea itself. "Plagiarism is the "wrongful appropriation" and "stealing and publication" of another author's "language, thoughts, ideas, or expressions" and the representation of them as one's own original work." Note the last phrase ... and the representation of them as one's own original work. Wikipedia. The last phrase is the essential element.

    – Buffy
    8 hours ago








  • 4





    I don't claim it isn't a violation, but it would be of copyright. A different matter with a different solution.

    – Buffy
    7 hours ago






  • 3





    Regarding your quote from the Wiki article, this supports that this is plagiarism. In particular, this is the "wrongful appropriation" of another author's "language." Wrongful appropriation of either language or ideas is still plagiarism. The distinction between plagiarism and copyright violation is more that the former is an academic integrity concern, while the latter is a legal concern. Plagiarism can concern either language or ideas, while copyright (of written works) is normally solely concerned with language.

    – reirab
    5 hours ago








  • 3





    @reirab I know my publisher stated in its letter to the student that publishing his work with the closely paraphrased text would in its opinion constitute copyright infringement. And it would constitute copyright infringement precisely because its plagiarism. I'm pretty sure the publisher consulted its attorney when composing the letter, as it told me it was going to do so.

    – Grinnell
    5 hours ago


















10














You seem to be confusing two things. Copyright is about words. Plagiarism is about ideas. If you have something copyrighted (almost anything you write and publish) copying your words is possibly a violation. The other paper may be have overstepped the bounds of copyright here.



But if they credit you with the underlying ideas behind the words, then it isn't plagiarism and is probably why people stop responding when you explain what happened. If the other person says or implies "these are my ideas" when, in fact, they are yours, they have plagiarized and that is true even if they use none of your words to express the idea.



But if you are credited, it just isn't plagiarism. A reader of the other work seem to be able to go to your work to find a more complete context of the idea and the original words.



You may, however, have a copyright claim or not, but it is a completely different issue. It is possible, also, that in publishing a book, you gave your copyright to your publisher. In that case it is up to them to make the claim.





Note that I'm not saying that what was done was ok, just that it better to be accurate in a claim of wrongdoing than to be inaccurate and confuse things.



And to be honest, I'm not close enough to the problem nor do I know enough to be able to say definitively that there is wrongdoing here or not. So I reserve judgement on that.






share|improve this answer





















  • 6





    I understand what you're saying ("if you are credited, it just isn't plagiarism"), but excessive paraphrasing, even if the original author is credited, is widely regarded as plagiarism. See the above UNC-Chapel Hill quote about this in my original post. Even Harvard notes "It's not enough to change a few words here and there and leave the rest; instead, you must completely restate the ideas in the passage in your own words. If your own language is too close to the original, then you are plagiarizing, even if you do provide a citation" (Harvard's emphasis).

    – Grinnell
    9 hours ago








  • 4





    The difference is widely misunderstood. It can be plagiarism if the other uses none of your words. Plagiarism isn't about the expression of the idea, but about the idea itself. "Plagiarism is the "wrongful appropriation" and "stealing and publication" of another author's "language, thoughts, ideas, or expressions" and the representation of them as one's own original work." Note the last phrase ... and the representation of them as one's own original work. Wikipedia. The last phrase is the essential element.

    – Buffy
    8 hours ago








  • 4





    I don't claim it isn't a violation, but it would be of copyright. A different matter with a different solution.

    – Buffy
    7 hours ago






  • 3





    Regarding your quote from the Wiki article, this supports that this is plagiarism. In particular, this is the "wrongful appropriation" of another author's "language." Wrongful appropriation of either language or ideas is still plagiarism. The distinction between plagiarism and copyright violation is more that the former is an academic integrity concern, while the latter is a legal concern. Plagiarism can concern either language or ideas, while copyright (of written works) is normally solely concerned with language.

    – reirab
    5 hours ago








  • 3





    @reirab I know my publisher stated in its letter to the student that publishing his work with the closely paraphrased text would in its opinion constitute copyright infringement. And it would constitute copyright infringement precisely because its plagiarism. I'm pretty sure the publisher consulted its attorney when composing the letter, as it told me it was going to do so.

    – Grinnell
    5 hours ago
















10












10








10







You seem to be confusing two things. Copyright is about words. Plagiarism is about ideas. If you have something copyrighted (almost anything you write and publish) copying your words is possibly a violation. The other paper may be have overstepped the bounds of copyright here.



But if they credit you with the underlying ideas behind the words, then it isn't plagiarism and is probably why people stop responding when you explain what happened. If the other person says or implies "these are my ideas" when, in fact, they are yours, they have plagiarized and that is true even if they use none of your words to express the idea.



But if you are credited, it just isn't plagiarism. A reader of the other work seem to be able to go to your work to find a more complete context of the idea and the original words.



You may, however, have a copyright claim or not, but it is a completely different issue. It is possible, also, that in publishing a book, you gave your copyright to your publisher. In that case it is up to them to make the claim.





Note that I'm not saying that what was done was ok, just that it better to be accurate in a claim of wrongdoing than to be inaccurate and confuse things.



And to be honest, I'm not close enough to the problem nor do I know enough to be able to say definitively that there is wrongdoing here or not. So I reserve judgement on that.






share|improve this answer















You seem to be confusing two things. Copyright is about words. Plagiarism is about ideas. If you have something copyrighted (almost anything you write and publish) copying your words is possibly a violation. The other paper may be have overstepped the bounds of copyright here.



But if they credit you with the underlying ideas behind the words, then it isn't plagiarism and is probably why people stop responding when you explain what happened. If the other person says or implies "these are my ideas" when, in fact, they are yours, they have plagiarized and that is true even if they use none of your words to express the idea.



But if you are credited, it just isn't plagiarism. A reader of the other work seem to be able to go to your work to find a more complete context of the idea and the original words.



You may, however, have a copyright claim or not, but it is a completely different issue. It is possible, also, that in publishing a book, you gave your copyright to your publisher. In that case it is up to them to make the claim.





Note that I'm not saying that what was done was ok, just that it better to be accurate in a claim of wrongdoing than to be inaccurate and confuse things.



And to be honest, I'm not close enough to the problem nor do I know enough to be able to say definitively that there is wrongdoing here or not. So I reserve judgement on that.







share|improve this answer














share|improve this answer



share|improve this answer








edited 7 hours ago

























answered 9 hours ago









BuffyBuffy

44.7k12143229




44.7k12143229








  • 6





    I understand what you're saying ("if you are credited, it just isn't plagiarism"), but excessive paraphrasing, even if the original author is credited, is widely regarded as plagiarism. See the above UNC-Chapel Hill quote about this in my original post. Even Harvard notes "It's not enough to change a few words here and there and leave the rest; instead, you must completely restate the ideas in the passage in your own words. If your own language is too close to the original, then you are plagiarizing, even if you do provide a citation" (Harvard's emphasis).

    – Grinnell
    9 hours ago








  • 4





    The difference is widely misunderstood. It can be plagiarism if the other uses none of your words. Plagiarism isn't about the expression of the idea, but about the idea itself. "Plagiarism is the "wrongful appropriation" and "stealing and publication" of another author's "language, thoughts, ideas, or expressions" and the representation of them as one's own original work." Note the last phrase ... and the representation of them as one's own original work. Wikipedia. The last phrase is the essential element.

    – Buffy
    8 hours ago








  • 4





    I don't claim it isn't a violation, but it would be of copyright. A different matter with a different solution.

    – Buffy
    7 hours ago






  • 3





    Regarding your quote from the Wiki article, this supports that this is plagiarism. In particular, this is the "wrongful appropriation" of another author's "language." Wrongful appropriation of either language or ideas is still plagiarism. The distinction between plagiarism and copyright violation is more that the former is an academic integrity concern, while the latter is a legal concern. Plagiarism can concern either language or ideas, while copyright (of written works) is normally solely concerned with language.

    – reirab
    5 hours ago








  • 3





    @reirab I know my publisher stated in its letter to the student that publishing his work with the closely paraphrased text would in its opinion constitute copyright infringement. And it would constitute copyright infringement precisely because its plagiarism. I'm pretty sure the publisher consulted its attorney when composing the letter, as it told me it was going to do so.

    – Grinnell
    5 hours ago
















  • 6





    I understand what you're saying ("if you are credited, it just isn't plagiarism"), but excessive paraphrasing, even if the original author is credited, is widely regarded as plagiarism. See the above UNC-Chapel Hill quote about this in my original post. Even Harvard notes "It's not enough to change a few words here and there and leave the rest; instead, you must completely restate the ideas in the passage in your own words. If your own language is too close to the original, then you are plagiarizing, even if you do provide a citation" (Harvard's emphasis).

    – Grinnell
    9 hours ago








  • 4





    The difference is widely misunderstood. It can be plagiarism if the other uses none of your words. Plagiarism isn't about the expression of the idea, but about the idea itself. "Plagiarism is the "wrongful appropriation" and "stealing and publication" of another author's "language, thoughts, ideas, or expressions" and the representation of them as one's own original work." Note the last phrase ... and the representation of them as one's own original work. Wikipedia. The last phrase is the essential element.

    – Buffy
    8 hours ago








  • 4





    I don't claim it isn't a violation, but it would be of copyright. A different matter with a different solution.

    – Buffy
    7 hours ago






  • 3





    Regarding your quote from the Wiki article, this supports that this is plagiarism. In particular, this is the "wrongful appropriation" of another author's "language." Wrongful appropriation of either language or ideas is still plagiarism. The distinction between plagiarism and copyright violation is more that the former is an academic integrity concern, while the latter is a legal concern. Plagiarism can concern either language or ideas, while copyright (of written works) is normally solely concerned with language.

    – reirab
    5 hours ago








  • 3





    @reirab I know my publisher stated in its letter to the student that publishing his work with the closely paraphrased text would in its opinion constitute copyright infringement. And it would constitute copyright infringement precisely because its plagiarism. I'm pretty sure the publisher consulted its attorney when composing the letter, as it told me it was going to do so.

    – Grinnell
    5 hours ago










6




6





I understand what you're saying ("if you are credited, it just isn't plagiarism"), but excessive paraphrasing, even if the original author is credited, is widely regarded as plagiarism. See the above UNC-Chapel Hill quote about this in my original post. Even Harvard notes "It's not enough to change a few words here and there and leave the rest; instead, you must completely restate the ideas in the passage in your own words. If your own language is too close to the original, then you are plagiarizing, even if you do provide a citation" (Harvard's emphasis).

– Grinnell
9 hours ago







I understand what you're saying ("if you are credited, it just isn't plagiarism"), but excessive paraphrasing, even if the original author is credited, is widely regarded as plagiarism. See the above UNC-Chapel Hill quote about this in my original post. Even Harvard notes "It's not enough to change a few words here and there and leave the rest; instead, you must completely restate the ideas in the passage in your own words. If your own language is too close to the original, then you are plagiarizing, even if you do provide a citation" (Harvard's emphasis).

– Grinnell
9 hours ago






4




4





The difference is widely misunderstood. It can be plagiarism if the other uses none of your words. Plagiarism isn't about the expression of the idea, but about the idea itself. "Plagiarism is the "wrongful appropriation" and "stealing and publication" of another author's "language, thoughts, ideas, or expressions" and the representation of them as one's own original work." Note the last phrase ... and the representation of them as one's own original work. Wikipedia. The last phrase is the essential element.

– Buffy
8 hours ago







The difference is widely misunderstood. It can be plagiarism if the other uses none of your words. Plagiarism isn't about the expression of the idea, but about the idea itself. "Plagiarism is the "wrongful appropriation" and "stealing and publication" of another author's "language, thoughts, ideas, or expressions" and the representation of them as one's own original work." Note the last phrase ... and the representation of them as one's own original work. Wikipedia. The last phrase is the essential element.

– Buffy
8 hours ago






4




4





I don't claim it isn't a violation, but it would be of copyright. A different matter with a different solution.

– Buffy
7 hours ago





I don't claim it isn't a violation, but it would be of copyright. A different matter with a different solution.

– Buffy
7 hours ago




3




3





Regarding your quote from the Wiki article, this supports that this is plagiarism. In particular, this is the "wrongful appropriation" of another author's "language." Wrongful appropriation of either language or ideas is still plagiarism. The distinction between plagiarism and copyright violation is more that the former is an academic integrity concern, while the latter is a legal concern. Plagiarism can concern either language or ideas, while copyright (of written works) is normally solely concerned with language.

– reirab
5 hours ago







Regarding your quote from the Wiki article, this supports that this is plagiarism. In particular, this is the "wrongful appropriation" of another author's "language." Wrongful appropriation of either language or ideas is still plagiarism. The distinction between plagiarism and copyright violation is more that the former is an academic integrity concern, while the latter is a legal concern. Plagiarism can concern either language or ideas, while copyright (of written works) is normally solely concerned with language.

– reirab
5 hours ago






3




3





@reirab I know my publisher stated in its letter to the student that publishing his work with the closely paraphrased text would in its opinion constitute copyright infringement. And it would constitute copyright infringement precisely because its plagiarism. I'm pretty sure the publisher consulted its attorney when composing the letter, as it told me it was going to do so.

– Grinnell
5 hours ago







@reirab I know my publisher stated in its letter to the student that publishing his work with the closely paraphrased text would in its opinion constitute copyright infringement. And it would constitute copyright infringement precisely because its plagiarism. I'm pretty sure the publisher consulted its attorney when composing the letter, as it told me it was going to do so.

– Grinnell
5 hours ago












Grinnell is a new contributor. Be nice, and check out our Code of Conduct.










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